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Deep Feelings between Men


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Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 19.03.2008 23:16:17 GMT+01:00
A. Märten meint:
Never encountered an intelligent homophobe. Having said this, a book comes to my mind which encloses a very interesting master/disciple relationship and has vengeance as prime motive. Stephen Frys "The Stars Tennisballs" picks up the narrative structure of Dumas "Le conte de Monte Christo".
The book is much darker than I expected from the comedien Fry and cought me off-hand with its depth.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 12:03:40 GMT+01:00
Tedesca meint:
Hi,
why don't you try "What I loved" by Siri Hustvedt?
Cheers,
tedesca

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 12:11:06 GMT+01:00
E. W. meint:
Sounds interesting. But then I wouldn't be surprised about darkness in Fry. He wrote a whole book about his bouts of depression after all.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 12:30:06 GMT+01:00
sista A meint:
@Tante Li

Strange, and here I always thought stupidity was an essential requirement for joining that particular little club ;-).

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 12:55:03 GMT+01:00
A. Märten meint:
@ E. W.
I havent read much by Fry, yet (but Im in fact infected at the moment by his ingenuity) and what you say is of course true. His depression, (I think its good that hes open about it) may be a source of his sombre writing.
When I started reading the book I expected something utterly different because hes a renowned comedy writer and it even starts out very funny indeed. But the turns the story takes drag the reader into the deepest and scariest corners of human psychology all along garnished with his probably infinite Veda and his instinctive feeling for language.

@ sista A
Thats what Im saying. Unfortunately its not that little, this club.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 16:53:38 GMT+01:00
sista A meint:
@E. Rolle

Believe me, I know. Trying to be funny is just some kind of automatic knee-jerk reaction when I get a little upset.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 19:31:07 GMT+01:00
A. Märten meint:
Oh no, I got that. Sad as it is, one of the few things we can do is making up our minds for new books in this thread.
Its really interesting to get some "high culture" hints here. Because I find this topic so intriguingIm reading a lot of stories on the internet.
Theres a genre in fanfiction called "slash" where male characters from all kinds of movies, books and TV-shows and their relationship is explored. The texts vary from drabble to epic, mere charcter studies to porn and theres a lot of rubbish around there. But more than once Ive read stories by certain writers which just left me speechless. Nearly all the authors and readers are, like me, female. Thats odd, isnt it? Are women not only more tolerant towards those relationsships but in fact...attracted?

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 20.03.2008 21:02:52 GMT+01:00
E. W. meint:
Of course we are! And why would that be surprising? Apart from the well known fact that men tend to have "a thing" for lesbians, I hold the theory that women are attracted to the surprising emotional openness that gay men display. It is so much rarer to see men caressing each other than women or heterosexual individuals doing the same. That's only one motive for finding gay male relationships fascinating, but arguably not the least of them.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 21.03.2008 11:22:33 GMT+01:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 14.04.2008 08:35:56 GMT+02:00
Tante Li meint:
Maybe we should as well be more tolerant with all the poor homophobes. Every fool has the right to cultivate his own prejudices and phobias. ;-)
And without them we couldn't enjoy so many different stories with these decisive society conflicts.

@sista A
Thank you for your precious tip of MZB's Shadow-Text. It is the missing link between Heritage and Exile. Do you know what this unfinished novel "Relunctant King" is about? I could imagine it's Regis' further story of his interesting live. I hope so - and that it will be published soon!

I saw the "The Celluloid Closet" twice and enjoy every time "Ben Hur" is telecasted (today 20:15 at Tele5) for this special scene wherein the friends throwing their spears (javelins?) and other mentioned film clips.

@E.W.
That's true! Beside this after making some bad experiences with heteromen it is heartening to believe there are men existing with deep feelings who are not ashamed of them.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 21.03.2008 21:14:57 GMT+01:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 23.03.2008 01:13:36 GMT+01:00
sista A meint:
No offense, Tante Li, but nope, zero tolerance. Prejudices aren't necessarily a bad thing, e.g. against canned food or car accidents (they suck), and to suffer from a phobia is a really terrible thing. But these people are simply assholes and if somebody just hates me and mine without any reason whatsoever, it doesn't really put me in the mood for tolerance.

Besides, there are so many more interesting phobias as I learned today (http://www.phobialist.com/), e.g. alektorophobia (fear of chickens) or arachibutyrophobia (fear of peanut butter sticking to the roof of the mouth - I kid you not!)

But anyway, to answer your question (to the best of my knowledge): As you probably know Marion Zimmer Bradley died a while ago, and Diane L. Paxton finished a couple of her books but whether "Reluctant King" will ever be finished remains a big question. I wouldn't hold my breath. Would be nice though because it really seems to have been planned as a sequel to Exile (which is btw a re-write of "The Sword of Aldones", which you should never buy because it's crap.). I'm glad you liked the story :-).

@E. Rolle: If you are interested in some classier literary books, you might want to have a look at Christopher Isherwood. It's been a while but I think I liked his "Berlin Novels" very much. Also definitely "literature" are the novels by James Baldwin (e.g. "Giovanni's Room"), though they are generally a bit too depressing for my taste. Then there is Alan Hollinghurst. I've read "The Spell", and personally found it a little tedious but, hey, the guy got a Booker Prize, so don't mind me. Also highly acclaimed by the critics is Adam Mars-Jones. I only remember "Monopolies of Loss" which is a collection of short stories about AIDS and its consequences, so nothing much to put a smile on your face but well-written. A classic is "The City and the Pillar" by Gore Vidal. I don't remember much about the book but I know that I liked the writing and hated the ending. This probably doesn't sound like much of a recommendation but as you might have noticed from my postings so far, generally I'm all for happy endings and blue skies ;-).

Which brings me to my last tips for today, two of my all time favourite movies: "Torch Song Trilogy" and "Beautiful Thing". Sad, funny, wonderful both of them. "Beautiful Thing" is a british production about two very average teenage boys (except that they aren't) and their first love in the suburbs of London, and "Torch Song Trilogy" (starring Harvey Firstein, the great Anne Bancroft and Mathew Broderick) is about Arnold, a jewish female impersonator, his love, his life and his mother. Enjoy!

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 23.03.2008 17:28:04 GMT+01:00
Griesmayer meint:
[Die meisten Kunden meinen, dass dieser Beitrag nicht zur Diskussion gehört. Beitrag dennoch anzeigen. Alle nicht nützlichen Einträge anzeigen.]

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 23.03.2008 18:21:05 GMT+01:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 23.03.2008 20:08:23 GMT+01:00
sista A meint:
Boys and girls, I suggest we all put the little helpful/feedback buttons to good use, shall we?

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 23.03.2008 18:29:27 GMT+01:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 25.03.2008 11:06:14 GMT+01:00
Tante Li meint:
:-)

Happy Easter-Holidays !

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Have a coloured easter-egg ...

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 11.04.2008 00:07:50 GMT+02:00
I've read perhaps half of the books mentioned in this forum and find that there's some wonderful reading listed. In the nineties I read Storm Constantine's Wraethu omnibus (three novels in one) and found the imagery breathtaking. The world is more Sci-Fi than the other suggestions, yet well worth the read.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 14.04.2008 00:30:02 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 14.04.2008 00:33:01 GMT+02:00
Lina Gerhards meint:
since I've just come into the world of books about homosexuals (been reading fanfictions for years now), I can only recommend these. if you really are interested, try fanfiction.net, and for more naughty (and sometimes really scary) work, go to adultfanfiction.net. I couldn't live without ff.net anymore; some authors there are amazing!
It's really interesting to read how they manage to put gay relationships into the universes of, for example, Harry Potter, without making it sound unlikely. I must say, I like good HP fanfictions a lot more than the books! (my favourite author is Lomonaaeren. simply awesome! and I think you'd like them if you're looking for deep, real stories. a must-read ;)

PS: zero tolerance for homophobes.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 02.05.2008 10:34:01 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 02.05.2008 10:46:36 GMT+02:00
Tante Li meint:
@sista A
Did you see that there will be a new sequel on the "Nightrunner Series" by Lynn Flewelling published in June 2008 ?
I am really exited about this and looking forward to read it.

"...
Shadows Return (Nightrunner) von Lynn Flewelling von Spectra Books (Taschenbuch - 24. Juni 2008)
Preis: EUR 5,99

Vorbestellbar
Kostenlose Lieferung möglich.
..."
(Amazon)

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 04.05.2008 18:21:37 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 10.08.2008 15:02:28 GMT+02:00
Pseudonym007 meint:
I've recently read "Melusine" by Sarah Monette. It's quite good, detailed original fantasy world and a rambling angsty plot. The hero Felix used to be a male prostitute (now he's a court wizard). Lots of more of less open male relationships, and not to forget CE DRAMA ;-). And there's at least three books in this series. Recommended!
Another tip would be the Sci-Fi series by Karin Lowachee "Cagebird" etc. I'm not sure which of the three books had the little blond male whore/assassin/spy as the hero, but it was good!
Another classic fantasy novel where M/M relationships play the main part would be "The fire's stone" by Tanya Huff. I've reread that book many times!

---NEW---
My recommendations tend to dark and dangerous side of male / male relationships - have a look at my newest find: The Administration Series by Manna.

"Mind F+++" and "Quid Pro Quo" by Manna Francis (Casperian Books Llc)
Seriously, one of the most original M/M stories I've read this year. Part Mystery/Sci-Fi, part love story with a twist. Addictive!

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 04.05.2008 18:38:59 GMT+02:00
sista A meint:
Hi Tante Li,

great news, thank you! I know she did claim it wasn't a trilogy in the foreword to Traitor's Moon but she certainly took her own sweet time to come up with the proof for that ;-). Plus, my reading list is getting dangerously short so every addition is more than welcome :-).

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 06.05.2008 19:23:58 GMT+02:00
Griesmayer meint:
[Die meisten Kunden meinen, dass dieser Beitrag nicht zur Diskussion gehört. Beitrag dennoch anzeigen. Alle nicht nützlichen Einträge anzeigen.]

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 06.05.2008 21:54:22 GMT+02:00
Skilliard meint:
I also would highly recommend the books of Sarah Monette. The three around Felix Harrowgate and Mildmay the Fox (1 Melusine, 2 The Virtue and 3 The Mirador) and not to forget the newest one: A Companion to Wolves.
And then there is the "Raised by Wolves"-Series written by W. A. Hoffman.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 12.05.2008 23:28:37 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 13.05.2008 01:10:32 GMT+02:00
sista A meint:
@Griesmayer: I must admit I was a little surprised by your posting. I didn't know that straight men's main interest in lesbians required the ability to read but I'm thrilled to hear it. What have you been reading lately? Please, do tell. I'm sure nobody would want the straight male readers of this forum to feel excluded. Or maybe you could start your own forum? Surely there are dozens of men who would like to share their considered opinions on "The Well of Loneliness" or the latest novel by Sarah Waters. Don't be shy.

As for the purpose of this forum - I wouldn't like to get "unhelpful" ratings :-) - I've just finished reading "Carnival" by Elizabeth Bear. When I read the synopsis I was a little sceptical at first. It sounded a lot like a couple of 70's feminist science fiction books I've read which were quite innovative for their time but seem maybe a little heavy-handed these days. But I must say that I was pleasantly surprised. It took me a while to get into it but in my opinion it is well worth a try.

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 16.05.2008 10:50:35 GMT+02:00
Hi Tante Li,

I bet you will like "One Mississippi" by Mark Childress!

Anette

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 16.05.2008 12:37:22 GMT+02:00
Tedesca meint:
Hallo Anette,
es passt zwar nicht hier her, aber schön, dass Sie wieder hier sind!
Liebe Grüße aus Wien,
tedesca

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 18.05.2008 10:29:29 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 21.05.2009 19:24:34 GMT+02:00
Tante Li meint:
@sista A
*lol*
You hit the mark!

@ Anette
Thank you very much :-)

Antwort auf einen früheren Beitrag vom 19.05.2008 12:19:21 GMT+02:00
Zuletzt vom Autor geändert am 19.05.2008 12:21:16 GMT+02:00
S.H. meint:
Thanks for a lot of books I have never heard about.
I can recommend "André Aciman, Call me by your name", a (sad) but captivating m/m lovestory which takes place in Italy at the beginning of the 1980s.
A very beautiful and highly recommandable book is "Eine Welt dazwischen" by Aline Sax. There will be an English translation published in October 2008 by the title "We two boys", but since you also read German, you can pick up the German version of the original Belgish book. It's a realy special vey well written book not to be missed. There is a sequel to this book, which I haven't read yet. However, in my oppinion the book didn't need a sequel.
I also can recommend a book by a Finish author "Troll A lovestory", the book is a little bit different but I couldn't stop reading it.
Last but not least there is a nice little entertaining movie "Boy culture" based on a book with the same title by Matthew Rettenmund which is also a very easy read.
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